WA3E Bug Topic

Help Topics, Bug Reports, Feature Requests, etc.
Post Reply
User avatar
Pawelec
Rainbow Master
Posts: 690
Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2008 8:37 am

Post by Pawelec » Sun Oct 19, 2014 5:45 pm

So, as I've written above, I have 3 machines and all of them have the same trouble running WAE3's wg.exe. As I used a copy of wg.exe from the Win7 machine on all three, I decided to upload my wg.exe for you - if someone was as nice as to test it on their machine, I'd be very grateful. Of course backup your wg.exe before the test!

The file is too big for PC Puzzle attachment standards, so there's MediaFire link: Pawelec's Buggy WAE3 wg.exe

If you have troubles running this wg.exe then there's something wrong with my wg.exe copy and getting one from someone who has no issues should help.

If you have no troubles running this wg.exe I'll have to look for similarities between the three machines, what most probably won't be easy.
"Let us return to the past; it will be progress."
by Giuseppe Verdi
garirry
Rainbow Star
Posts: 1665
Joined: Sat Mar 21, 2009 6:18 pm
Location: Canada
Contact:

Post by garirry » Sun Oct 19, 2014 5:59 pm

Nope, no issues. I guess there is something all three machines have in common that causes the issue. Tell if one of them has anything (and I mean anything) common to another one, whether the model number of a graphic card/processor, the manufacturer, your operating system, the computer manufacturer, desktop/laptop on battery/laptop plugged in, anything pretty much.
User avatar
Pawelec
Rainbow Master
Posts: 690
Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2008 8:37 am

Post by Pawelec » Sun Oct 19, 2014 6:20 pm

So, all three run Bitdefender Free Antivirus, but the issue was present on Win7 machine before I installed Bitdefender, also disabling the antivirus doesn't solve the problem.

All three have Advanced System Care 7 installed and used once a month to do system clean-up, but again, the issue was present on Win7 machine before I installed that software. What may be worth noticing is the fact I used CCleaner on all three before I moved to ASC7, so the trouble may have something with registry entries (although I always check what the program is trying to change and I've never seen anything related to CPU, GPU, Blitz, DirectX nor Midnight Synergy games).

As for the software installed on all three machines I can list the latest Java, Shockwave, Macromedia and QuickTime, Microsoft Visual Studio 2010 packages, Sony PC Companion, VLC Media Player, DAEMON Tools Lite, Steinberg Cubase AI5, WinRAR, PhotoFiltre Studio X and some of my sister's games: SPORE, Zoo Tycoon 2, Insaniquarium Deluxe, Bejeweled 3 and Super Collapse! 3. All three machines have HP printer's driver installed, but for different printers. There are no other hardware similarities than the fact all three have Intel's CPU and Nvidia's GPU.

Before someone asks me if I checked my BIOS, I've already updated it to the latest version and it didn't help. Also, it doesn't have any GPU-related options in it (besides my Win7 machine is Dell XPS L702X with BIOS v. A19). Changing energy management mode and switching between plugged/battery has no effect as well.

I may try downgrading my GPU's (GT 555M) drivers to any version released before April 2014 to see if there's any change, but I seriously doubt it can help.

EDIT: I'll try running WAE3 while playing not on my laptop's LCD screen, but on TV connected with HDMI cable - I've read Dell has implemented a feature which forces the Nvidia GPU to be used with external display.
"Let us return to the past; it will be progress."
by Giuseppe Verdi
User avatar
Jutomi
Rainbow AllStar
Posts: 4364
Joined: Tue Oct 15, 2013 8:42 pm

Computer Synergy

Post by Jutomi » Sun Oct 19, 2014 6:49 pm

It could be something else, though... :|

Both of my brother's computers died, the same way,
on different hours of the same day.
Perhaps you're having a computer synergism problem like MiToJu had? :?
Your only little stinker that's absolutely NOT a z-bot by this name,
Jutomi~ :mrgreen:

Also, if you want to see my level list, here it is! :D
(Also: List of Hubs, WA Manual)
Oh, and my YT wonderland channel. Forgot about that.
User avatar
Pawelec
Rainbow Master
Posts: 690
Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2008 8:37 am

Post by Pawelec » Sun Oct 19, 2014 7:05 pm

Plugging the laptop to the TV didn't help, it's still using the CPU. What's more, I've discovered every time I get the CPU/wg.exe problem, the CPU temperature rises much.

I suppose there's a registry error which I caused unintentionally with CCleaner/ASC7, but I cannot find it, everything within DirectX-related areas seems to be fine.

I've attached my DxDiag reports (both x86 and x64) in a .zip archive, maybe you'll find something interesting in them (although I didn't).
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
"Let us return to the past; it will be progress."
by Giuseppe Verdi
garirry
Rainbow Star
Posts: 1665
Joined: Sat Mar 21, 2009 6:18 pm
Location: Canada
Contact:

Post by garirry » Sun Oct 19, 2014 7:21 pm

What software is running while you were testing the editor? Try closing absolutely all programs then test the editor. If it still doesn't work, then it's most likely something wrong with the system/hardware. Try opening some other "heavy" game and see if it works. If closing the programs works, try opening an application one by one, and as soon as you open one that starts lagging the editor, that is probably the program that causes the computer to not run WAE.
User avatar
Pawelec
Rainbow Master
Posts: 690
Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2008 8:37 am

Post by Pawelec » Sun Oct 19, 2014 7:30 pm

Closing the programs didn't help, it must be something with the system (not the hardware, as I consider it impossible for 3 different machines to have same hardware issue). I think it is the registry, but I have no idea where and what to look for.
"Let us return to the past; it will be progress."
by Giuseppe Verdi
garirry
Rainbow Star
Posts: 1665
Joined: Sat Mar 21, 2009 6:18 pm
Location: Canada
Contact:

Post by garirry » Sun Oct 19, 2014 7:36 pm

Well, the easiest solution is to reinstall the system. This means finding your install disc (either came with your computer, or you can burn one using a program installed in your computer). Doing this will reset the system files, however, you need to backup your data and programs. You can just copy them to an external hard drive, then copy them back in your computer. (never backup data onto a USB flash drive).
User avatar
Pawelec
Rainbow Master
Posts: 690
Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2008 8:37 am

Post by Pawelec » Sun Oct 19, 2014 7:58 pm

Wow, WOW! Wait a while, I'm not that desperate... I'm not planning any reinstalls until I find the real cause of the issue. Let me find another Win7 machine to perform a test on.

In Nvidia Inspector, under Profile Manager I can see all WA games use non-standard driver index, 0x80857A28, which is set to 0x00000001 in all cases. I wonder what does it do, but as it's set to the same value in all WA games it cannot cause the issue.

What I can tell is that the lag for sure caused by lack of operation memory, as running MoFI on integrated GPU gives quite a lot of lag.

EDIT: If you Google for "Mysteries of Fire Island" DirectX and "Planet of the Z-Bots" DirectX you may see the sites state that DirectX libraries for PotZ compared to those for MoFI were... downgraded. This can be the cause of the issue, as DirectX6 has way worse support of GPUs than DirectX7.
"Let us return to the past; it will be progress."
by Giuseppe Verdi
garirry
Rainbow Star
Posts: 1665
Joined: Sat Mar 21, 2009 6:18 pm
Location: Canada
Contact:

Post by garirry » Mon Oct 20, 2014 8:59 pm

Sorry for the slightly late reply, I was away.

Anyways, since all Wonderland games are created using Blitz3D, I searched and found out that by default, Blitz3D uses DirectX6.

Indeed, searching for them shows that POTZ requires DX6, while MOFI requires DX7, which could be the issue.

That means, if this IS the issue, then apparently your GPU isn't supported. You said that all your PCs have Nvidias, right? I think I heard that WSW sometimes shows badly-rendered text on certain Nvidia cards, which could mean Blitz3D has by itself some graphical/hardware limitations that I don't know about, since I never programmed anything using B3D.
User avatar
Pawelec
Rainbow Master
Posts: 690
Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2008 8:37 am

Post by Pawelec » Wed Oct 22, 2014 6:38 pm

I think I won't get this problem solved without Patrick's help, as only he knows exactly what are the differences between MoFI and PotZ graphic engines. Whatever they are, they are the direct cause of my troubles, as with MoFI everything works perfectly.

Now I'm also wondering what are the differences between Player's and Editor's rendering systems, as with the Editor I have no troubles.

Also, today an update to my GPU's drivers came out, which of course didn't solve the issue.
"Let us return to the past; it will be progress."
by Giuseppe Verdi
User avatar
Pawelec
Rainbow Master
Posts: 690
Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2008 8:37 am

Post by Pawelec » Wed Oct 22, 2014 8:36 pm

D-P, but the case got really interesting...

I remebered I've downloaded the UnOfficial PotZ Editor once and had no troubles running adventures with it. I found the directory and run it, as the adv.s were quite simple there weren't many meshes to see if there's any 3D-related lag. After that I noticed an improvement in WA3E performance - it uses the GPU again, but... the more meshes are in the adv., the lesser is GPU usage, causing an absolute drop (GPU usage = 0%) in the most depending adv.s. This is an absurd, as more meshes need more GPU's power.

Moreover, the Google Chrome's impact on wg.exe's performace is even bigger now. I've noticed my Nvidia drivers use integrated graphics (Intel HD) to run Google Chrome, so there shouldn't be much of a conflict between both programs. I'll investigate the case further, but as GPU is available again I see some room for improvement.

EDIT: From my observations I can tell one thing: whenever water surface appears on screen, FPS drops significantly. Also, when I open the menu and all animations stop, I get 60 FPS immediately. I guess this has something to do with water waving animation.

EDIT2: And now I know the reason is not only water animation, but all animations. There's no lag when no moving objects are in the level, no matter how many meshes I use, but even small amount of animated objects causes huge lag.
"Let us return to the past; it will be progress."
by Giuseppe Verdi
User avatar
jdl
Rainbow SuperStar
Posts: 2883
Joined: Fri Jun 06, 2008 8:37 pm
Location: West Virginia, USA
Contact:

Post by jdl » Wed Oct 22, 2014 9:24 pm

I think the best thing to do would be to PM Patrick about the issue and see what he says.
User avatar
Pawelec
Rainbow Master
Posts: 690
Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2008 8:37 am

Post by Pawelec » Wed Oct 22, 2014 9:55 pm

PMing Patrick was the first thing I did, but he hasn't replied yet. The whole case starts to look like antivirus incopatibility issue. I've already discovered that the Editor doesn't like McAfee (Couldn't Load Mesh bug), maybe it also doesn't like Bitdefender? Are any Wonderlanders using Bitdefender here to say if they have any problems?
"Let us return to the past; it will be progress."
by Giuseppe Verdi
garirry
Rainbow Star
Posts: 1665
Joined: Sat Mar 21, 2009 6:18 pm
Location: Canada
Contact:

Post by garirry » Wed Oct 22, 2014 9:59 pm

Pawelec wrote:PMing Patrick was the first thing I did, but he hasn't replied yet. The whole case starts to look like antivirus incopatibility issue. I've already discovered that the Editor doesn't like McAfee (Couldn't Load Mesh bug), maybe it also doesn't like Bitdefender? Are any Wonderlanders using Bitdefender here to say if they have any problems?
Try quitting the antivirus and closing the entire process. I may try to install Bitdefender on a spare virtual machine and test to see if it works.
User avatar
Pawelec
Rainbow Master
Posts: 690
Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2008 8:37 am

Post by Pawelec » Wed Oct 22, 2014 10:09 pm

garirry wrote:
Pawelec wrote:PMing Patrick was the first thing I did, but he hasn't replied yet. The whole case starts to look like antivirus incopatibility issue. I've already discovered that the Editor doesn't like McAfee (Couldn't Load Mesh bug), maybe it also doesn't like Bitdefender? Are any Wonderlanders using Bitdefender here to say if they have any problems?
Try quitting the antivirus and closing the entire process. I may try to install Bitdefender on a spare virtual machine and test to see if it works.
I've already tried that, but without effect. The fact is Couldn't Load Mesh bug wasn't gone until I uninstalled McAfee, shutting it all off wasn't enough. And virtual machines are never a good choice, I'd not bother anyone with tests on them.
"Let us return to the past; it will be progress."
by Giuseppe Verdi
User avatar
Qloof234
Rainbow AllStar
Posts: 4193
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2007 10:33 pm
Location: Canada

Post by Qloof234 » Wed Oct 22, 2014 10:32 pm

Probably doesn't help much, but FWIW, I ran a byte-check on your "buggy" wg.exe. It's absolutely identical to the one I have on my computer, which is unmodified, so... something else is going on there.

I can also confirm a solid 59/60FPS on your jungle test level (though that's probably unfair of me considering that this is a heavy-duty gaming computer).

As for DirectX, I've noticed that there are some rendering differences between PoTZ and MoFI - namely, waterfalls in MoFI/WA1 look much nicer; large waterfalls just tile the texture, and waterfalls put side-by-side tile seamlessly without any stretching, whereas in PoTZ large waterfalls are stretched, side-by-side waterfalls are completely independent, and every waterfall has a rather ugly "shaded" look to it. Here's a picture of WA3's waterfalls to demonstrate:

Image

I suspect there's some connection here, but... I have no idea.
Image
garirry
Rainbow Star
Posts: 1665
Joined: Sat Mar 21, 2009 6:18 pm
Location: Canada
Contact:

Post by garirry » Wed Oct 22, 2014 11:35 pm

Tried installing Bitdefender's trial on Windows XP virtual machine. Strangely, bitdefender gives no change at all in terms of speed. Maybe I should try the super version, but hey, whatever.

My guess is that it is a combination of your antivirus + your graphic card, so if you are ready to take a sacrifice of your time, you may try uninstalling the application, trying, then installing it back. If you don't want to, then try closing the program, then ending all related processes in the task manager. Lemme know if it works.
User avatar
Pawelec
Rainbow Master
Posts: 690
Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2008 8:37 am

Post by Pawelec » Thu Oct 23, 2014 8:51 pm

I've just discovered the FPS is much higher while playing 1024x768 on fullscreen. I decided to do that because windowed mode was giving me frequent MAVs in the adventure selection screen. Not everything is perfect yet, but most adv.s work on 60 FPS with fullscreen.
"Let us return to the past; it will be progress."
by Giuseppe Verdi
User avatar
Pawelec
Rainbow Master
Posts: 690
Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2008 8:37 am

Post by Pawelec » Sat Oct 25, 2014 4:26 pm

D-P, but I noticed sometimes I close WA3E's wg.exe I get Bitdefender Free Antivirus stopped working alert. I think I'll try uninstalling it. What antivirus do you recommend to install instead of Bitdefender so I have no troubles with WA trilogy?
"Let us return to the past; it will be progress."
by Giuseppe Verdi
garirry
Rainbow Star
Posts: 1665
Joined: Sat Mar 21, 2009 6:18 pm
Location: Canada
Contact:

Post by garirry » Sat Oct 25, 2014 5:15 pm

Pawelec wrote:D-P, but I noticed sometimes I close WA3E's wg.exe I get Bitdefender Free Antivirus stopped working alert. I think I'll try uninstalling it. What antivirus do you recommend to install instead of Bitdefender so I have no troubles with WA trilogy?
Sadly, since I'm a Mac user, I can't really answer this question, as antiviruses are unnecessary on Macs and I don't need an antivirus on my VM since all I'm doing is using applications that don't work with my Mac.

Anyway, I know that my dad uses AVG Free on his computer, I have no idea if this would stop the lag issues and all, but what I can say is that it detects viruses pretty fine.
User avatar
Pawelec
Rainbow Master
Posts: 690
Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2008 8:37 am

Post by Pawelec » Sat Oct 25, 2014 7:42 pm

Problem solved!

OK, so I can confirm I made 3 pages of this topic without any major reason. The thing is the bug is gone together with Bitdefender Free Antivirus. AVG Free 2014 seems to be working fine with both the Editor (McAfee didn't like it much) and the Player (Bitdefender gave it some troubles), but as Collaboration Level Test gave me 60 FPS with no antivirus software, it gives 34 FPS with AVG Free 2014, fortunately adding the Editor's folder to AVG's exception list (BTW McAfee and Bitdefender don't have such feature) makes it 60 FPS again.

Seems antivirus software doesn't like Wonderland at all (Z-Bots influence?).


Also, I think I've found a bug not related to my problem: for me, dragging the Player window while on the Adventure Selection screen causes MAV. I don't know if that was reported.
Last edited by Pawelec on Sun Oct 26, 2014 8:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
"Let us return to the past; it will be progress."
by Giuseppe Verdi
garirry
Rainbow Star
Posts: 1665
Joined: Sat Mar 21, 2009 6:18 pm
Location: Canada
Contact:

Post by garirry » Sun Oct 26, 2014 6:39 am

Pawelec wrote:Problem solved!
Congrats! :D Hope my posts have been helpful.
Pawelec wrote:Also, I think I've found a bug not related to my problem: for me, dragging the Player window while on the Adventure Selection screen causes MAV. I don't know if that was reported.
I can confirm this is a general bug (meaning not only on your side), I just tested it and it MAVs on my side as well.
User avatar
Pawelec
Rainbow Master
Posts: 690
Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2008 8:37 am

Post by Pawelec » Sun Oct 26, 2014 9:43 am

I have important advice for everyone: to achieve best FPS, make sure your turn Threaded Optimization off for all Wonderland games - Blitz3D doesn't support it, so the process only uses up your memory. I was playing with my GPU's settings today and discovered I can get 60 FPS with all other settings maxed out when I disable Threaded Optimization (it was 29-42 FPS with T.O. turned on).
"Let us return to the past; it will be progress."
by Giuseppe Verdi
Caton
Rainbow Master
Posts: 674
Joined: Sat Sep 27, 2014 7:18 pm

Post by Caton » Wed Dec 03, 2014 4:58 am

I found a bug where the ice troll shoots though a wall tile.
Caton
Rainbow Master
Posts: 674
Joined: Sat Sep 27, 2014 7:18 pm

Post by Caton » Wed Dec 03, 2014 5:24 am

Editor Bug
Editor crashes when Thwart Data0 is changed. to + or -
User avatar
Qloof234
Rainbow AllStar
Posts: 4193
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2007 10:33 pm
Location: Canada

Post by Qloof234 » Wed Dec 03, 2014 6:38 am

Caton wrote:I found a bug where the ice troll shoots though a wall tile.
This bug has been reported a lot already. FireFlowers, Thwarts, and other such things can shoot through walls that are right next to them. It's a relic of the old wall-blink bug/cheat code.
Caton wrote:Editor Bug
Editor crashes when Thwart Data0 is changed. to + or -
Data0 isn't supported by the Thwart object.
Image
Caton
Rainbow Master
Posts: 674
Joined: Sat Sep 27, 2014 7:18 pm

Post by Caton » Wed Dec 03, 2014 6:41 am

but It work in the WA games.
I tested it my self.
but It should not crash when change to a number.
User avatar
Qloof234
Rainbow AllStar
Posts: 4193
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2007 10:33 pm
Location: Canada

Post by Qloof234 » Wed Dec 03, 2014 6:44 am

Okay, but what does it do? Since it's not in the Editor itself, I'm inclined to say it's not officially supported. The Editor crashing because you're doing something you aren't intended to isn't a bug that Patrick's obligated to fix.
Image
Caton
Rainbow Master
Posts: 674
Joined: Sat Sep 27, 2014 7:18 pm

Post by Caton » Wed Dec 03, 2014 6:48 am

like data0 does not crash with other objects but the thwart it crashes.
Post Reply