Ways to Die or Get Stuck in WA Trilogy Hub

billy bob · Post by **billy bob** » Fri Apr 11, 2014 4:09 am

I'd like to note that I can't test anything in WA1 at the moment for my copy has stopped functioning entirely now.

So if anyone thinks they've found anything someone else will have to make sure of it and give me a description that I can put up on the list. This is until I buy a new copy.

samuelthx · Post by **samuelthx** » Fri Apr 11, 2014 4:13 am

billy bob wrote:I'd like to note that I can't test anything in WA1 at the moment for my copy has stopped functioning entirely now.
So if anyone thinks they've found anything someone else will have to make sure of it and give me a description that I can put up on the list. This is until I buy a new copy.

Maybe you could ask Patrick for a replacement if the game is at fault

tyteen4a03 · Post by **tyteen4a03** » Fri Apr 11, 2014 12:28 pm

Digital copies can be replaced easily. You shouldn't need to buy a new one.

Wonderland King · Post by **Wonderland King** » Mon Apr 28, 2014 3:18 am

1) This.

2) Look at the screenshot...

Wonderland King · Post by **Wonderland King** » Tue Apr 29, 2014 1:56 am

Thanks for updating the list.

But about "quickly overtaking" Zoopi Lala, that's not really all - sorry, I should've clarified.

After you step on the spot above the red gate, Zoopi Lala will run up to the area where you are. Step down immediately so you're on the open red gate and talk to him so the adventure star appears. Then not only do you have to be fast after you win the adventure, you have to be fast before it too.

And I have another suspicion about a method I can't do. There's a... trick with dialog (not sure whether to call it a bug) where it stays with you even if you're transported to a different area. (For instance, I can maintain Z-Bot Prime's first dialog with me through the cutscene where I end up on Barren.) A piece of info for those of you who aren't familiar with the level editor: The events that happen when you're in a dialog/talking to a Stinker, such as a key appearing, are triggered by responses you click on and only happen in the level you're currently in.

So when you enter the area with "Lights Out", maybe you can talk to Doondilf or Zoopi Lala as you're stepping on the red arrow to go back up? Then the command to activate the Glow Gem and adventure star wouldn't be in the right level, so they wouldn't do anything. They won't activate it again if you talk to them, so...

But you need to have good timing to do this, and apparently I don't have good timing.

P.S. As the first to come up with and test the Hubble Bug, I (un)oficially declare that it shall be named Hubble's Law.

LittleZbot · Post by **LittleZbot** » Tue Apr 29, 2014 3:38 am

Ways to Die in Wonderland Adventures Trilogy Hub wrote:In the area where Zoopi Lala shows you how to use Pop magic, go south passed the bridges you activated then deactivate them with Pop. You'll never be able to return north.

Ways to Get Stuck in Wonderland Adventures Trilogy Hub wrote:In the area where Zoopi Lala shows you how to use Pop magic, go south passed the bridges you activated then deactivate them with Pop. You'll never be able to return north.

Uh...

billy bob · Post by **billy bob** » Tue Apr 29, 2014 5:36 pm

Wonderland King wrote:Thanks for updating the list. But about "quickly overtaking" Zoopi Lala, that's not really all - sorry, I should've clarified. After you step on the spot above the red gate, Zoopi Lala will run up to the area where you are. Step down immediately so you're on the open red gate and talk to him so the adventure star appears. Then not only do you have to be fast after you win the adventure, you have to be fast before it too.

I saw this, but no need, there's still enough time without the head start.

Wonderland King wrote:So when you enter the area with "Lights Out", maybe you can talk to Doondilf or Zoopi Lala as you're stepping on the red arrow to go back up? Then the command to activate the Glow Gem and adventure star wouldn't be in the right level, so they wouldn't do anything. They won't activate it again if you talk to them, so...

But you need to have good timing to do this, and apparently I don't have good timing.

So I've been trying. What is the method of movement that you think will work? As soon as I'm in the area I hold up, then just below the arrow I try to press up at a precise point so that I can click on the Stinker on the space above as I'm between the space below the arrow and the arrow itself. This may not be it. EDIT: You can't interact with an NPC while you're moving so this doesn't work. What is the method that you think will work?

LittleZbot wrote:Uh...

Fixed.

Wonderland King · Post by **Wonderland King** » Tue Apr 29, 2014 10:51 pm

billy bob wrote:
Wonderland King wrote:So when you enter the area with "Lights Out", maybe you can talk to Doondilf or Zoopi Lala as you're stepping on the red arrow to go back up? Then the command to activate the Glow Gem and adventure star wouldn't be in the right level, so they wouldn't do anything. They won't activate it again if you talk to them, so...

But you need to have good timing to do this, and apparently I don't have good timing.
So I've been trying. What is the method of movement that you think will work? As soon as I'm in the area I hold up, then just below the arrow I try to press up at a precise point so that I can click on the Stinker on the space above as I'm between the space below the arrow and the arrow itself. This may not be it. What is the method that you think will work?

No idea.

billy bob · Post by **billy bob** » Wed Apr 30, 2014 2:16 am

It's crazy. It's amazing. It's awesome.

I've got it to work, but it's no where near as simple as just talking to the NPC at the same time as walking onto the arrow.

First off, the NPC seems to be quicker than you, meaning that if you just try to speak with it while it's on the space above the arrow it will always occupy the arrow space first before you.

Second off, if you try to speak with it multiple spaces above the arrow then it won't work. This is because if you try to speak with an NPC while it's moving then you won't follow the NPC to where it's gone since you will just move to the space where it was while the player was ordered to talk to it, and if the NPC isn't still there then nothing will happen. This also means that letting an NPC passed the arrow then talking to it from the left or right won't work because the NPC is too fast and will have already left the space that it was on when you tried to talk with it.

Third off, the idea of moving onto the arrow first then talking to the NPC above the arrow so that the player would occupy the space first doesn't work simply because you can't choose to talk with an NPC while you're moving.

So then. How is it possible?

If only we could just get one of the NPCs to pause for a moment just before it moves onto the arrow space. That would mean that you could talk with it before it occupies the space which the arrow is on. Well? To make that little pause happen, we have to use the other NPC. We will have to do a little dance with Doondilf to make him retrace and step back onto the arrow space so that he occupies it blocking Zoopi Lala for a brief moment, then very quickly get onto the arrow space then mash the space above the arrow where Zoopi Lala is.

The setup for this: Don't hesitate at all between these moves otherwise it is probable that it won't work. Obviously you will want to put a save just before entering the area as it is quite difficult and should require multiple retries.
As soon as you enter the area, move up to the space below the arrow then move diagonal up-right once, then diagonal down left twice, then diagonal up right once more, then mash the mouse button for the space above the arrow. If you got it right then the dialogue will activate and you will be in the previous area at the same time. If it didn't work at the last bit then that means that while mashing you just didn't hit a right frame, so just keep trying and you will get it soon.

This method is a thing of beauty.

It is my favourite method of failing in the hub.

Wonderland King · Post by **Wonderland King** » Wed Apr 30, 2014 2:38 am

Man, that's cool.

Still can't do it, but I'm getting close...

But you forgot to update the list.

Wonderland King · Post by **Wonderland King** » Wed Apr 30, 2014 3:29 am

I finally did it. That... that was amazing.

Wonderland King · Post by **Wonderland King** » Thu May 01, 2014 3:08 am

As I was springing northeast in the Grynkler area, I talked to Grennfleagel to see what he'd say, and his dialog stayed with me as I bounced. I went through it (it's what he says after you rescue him), and the Grynklers acted like nothing had happened. Shiny and Grennfleagel did too, so I was stuck. I looked in the editor, and I wasn't sure why.

P.S. My first triple post!

billy bob · Post by **billy bob** » Thu May 01, 2014 4:18 pm

*adds to list*

This is very strange. Why would starting a dialogue with Grennfleagel make any difference? It's not as if there are commands in Grennfleagel's dialogue which counter events, because commands can only be set to activate for when you choose an option to say something, and if you wait without skipping through any of the dialogue you can still see that the Grynklers haven't moved.

It seems that, for some reason, being in the middle of a dialogue during the command for Grynklers and Shiny moving stops it from happening. When you were in the editor did you have a look at what makes up the delay between ending the dialogue with Shiny and Grynklers and Shiny moving?

And if you cancel Grennfleagel's dialogue at the right time then you can get it so that Shiny moves but the Grynklers don't. This can lead on to overtaking Shiny to the adventure star.

Qloof234 · Post by **Qloof234** » Thu May 01, 2014 8:47 pm

Oh, damn it. There was a similar bug with the Grynklers that I caught onto during testing. Never thought of trying Grennfleagel's dialogue though... Damn it.

The issue is that NPC Move commands don't activate while dialogue boxes are open. My guess (though I haven't checked in-editor so I don't know for certain) is that there's an NPC Move command somewhere that triggers the Grynkler "cutscene" - since a dialogue box is open, the command doesn't trigger.

Wonderland King · Post by **Wonderland King** » Fri May 02, 2014 12:37 am

Is the bug you found why the Grynklers don't have dialog?

billy bob · Post by **billy bob** » Fri May 02, 2014 2:17 pm

Method of death, MOFI, Wonderfalls
As soon as you enter the second area immediately talk to Morklin then move onto the space on your left, where a red gate will rise from below you.

Qloof234 wrote:The issue is that NPC Move commands don't activate while dialogue boxes are open. My guess (though I haven't checked in-editor so I don't know for certain) is that there's an NPC Move command somewhere that triggers the Grynkler "cutscene" - since a dialogue box is open, the command doesn't trigger.

Yes, there's a chomper in the bottom right corner which is released when you talk to Shiny before you are flung northwest. The chomper hits buttons which make the torches go out and the rainbow effects appear and the Grynklers run away and Shiny come.

Wonderland King · Post by **Wonderland King** » Sat May 10, 2014 4:52 am

Lucky-Luc wrote:1. There are two types of chomper movement, which I'll call "brained" and "unbrained" in analogy to DROD. Brained chompers think there is a way to reach you, while unbrained chompers don't see a way to do so.
2. As mentioned in "Detours" (POTZ), a braine chomper always tries to take the shortest path to you. To be more specific, it moves to the adjectant square that is the least steps away from you (I haven't completely examined how it breaks ties yet) and reevaluates the situation once it is there.
3. However, unbrained chompers order the squares by looking at the pythagorean distance between each adjectant square (including the one it stands on) and move to the square which is - beeline-wise - closest to you.
4. While this generally works out pretty well, there are a few quirks. For example, teleporters are always considered as obstacles, and pathmapping doesn't seem to recognize diagonal moves. Also, a spring for example doesn't hinder the chomper from thinking there's a path to you.

Quoted that because I'm too lazy to explain it myself. But my main point is that it works for chompers, NPCs (Stinkers, Kaboom!s, etc.), and the player character.

When you arrive in Wonderland, stand north east of Cedric-In-The-Morning and talk to him. After you finish talking to him, a command is triggered that make him go to an out of the way spot by the "Blinking Around" adventure star. Then block the path to the star. (It's a winding path, but it's actually very thin.) Because of pathfinding, he'll be "unbrained" and try to get close to it, in a position where he's to the southwest of trees or rocks. Then go further along the path, (he's still "unbrained", so he'll stay) and step on the space directly below where the adventure star will appear. There's a button there that'll make him go to a spot that's in the way. As he runs there, run out. There's no way to get back in.

P.S. I'm working on a folder with solutions to all 17 known ways to get stuck in MOFI and POTZ. I've been kinda busy lately, so it may take a while, but once I'm done I'm thinking of naming it Billy Bob's Bugs Be Gone... do any of you get that reference?

To be honest, I doubt if too many of you know where it's from...

billy bob · Post by **billy bob** » Sat May 10, 2014 12:36 pm

As my WA1 isn't functioning I'll just have to trust you on this one. However, could someone with a functioning WA1 post a description suitable for the list?

Wonderland King · Post by **Wonderland King** » Sat May 10, 2014 2:41 pm

No, it's in POTZ. Sorry for the confusion.

billy bob · Post by **billy bob** » Sun May 11, 2014 12:26 am

When you said Cedric-in-the-Morning teaching you how to use blink all I could think of was WA1. Of course you have to be retaught in WA3.

Good work, I've added it to the list.

You can also move onto the space below the inactive adventure star without talking to him at all. This can lead to amusing effects such as having him at both Star Summit and Forever Forest.

LittleZbot · Post by **LittleZbot** » Sun May 11, 2014 2:57 am

Wonderland King wrote:...I'm thinking of naming it Billy Bob's Bugs Be Gone... do any of you get that reference? To be honest, I doubt if too many of you know where it's from...

Hah hah. Very clever.

And yes, I do know where it's from.

Wonderman109 · Post by **Wonderman109** » Sun May 11, 2014 12:56 pm

Has anyone mentioned blinking behind Cedric into his canopy in WA1 on your last Blink? I did that once.

Wonderland King · Post by **Wonderland King** » Sun May 11, 2014 3:21 pm

It's already on the list.

Wonderman109 · Post by **Wonderman109** » Sun May 11, 2014 3:42 pm

What about
-going to the Void with a full inventory?
-a void Crystal destroying you in any part of the game?

billy bob · Post by **billy bob** » Sun May 11, 2014 4:31 pm

Wonderman109 wrote:What about
-going to the Void with a full inventory?
-a void Crystal destroying you in any part of the game?

You don't need inventory space in the void and after searching we've found one place where the void can fall on the player in the game.

Wonderland King · Post by **Wonderland King** » Sun May 11, 2014 7:41 pm

billy bob wrote: after searching we've found one place where the void can fall on the player in the game.

What do you mean? Where?

Wonderman109 · Post by **Wonderman109** » Sun May 11, 2014 8:53 pm

I think it's in the broken bridge area, if you're fast with dialog or something.

Wonderland King · Post by **Wonderland King** » Sun May 11, 2014 9:04 pm

Oh, that's right. I thought you meant the Void as a place.

Wonderman109 · Post by **Wonderman109** » Sun May 11, 2014 11:23 pm

Wonderman109 wrote:What about
-going to the Void with a full inventory?
-a void Crystal destroying you in any part of the game?

That's what they've been dubbed, I don't remember by who.

Wonderland King · Post by **Wonderland King** » Sun May 11, 2014 11:29 pm

Well, in POTZ, there is something called the void crystal.