Wonderland Adventures: Hidden Realms - Update Thread

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Wonderland Adventures: Hidden Realms - Update Thread

Post by Qloof234 » Wed Mar 05, 2014 7:04 am

Update Thread 2: Electric Boogaloo

Original Thread
June 19th, 2014 Trailer
  • CHAPTER 1: |||||||||- (Bugfixing - Overall: 95%)
    CHAPTER 2: |||||||||- (Bugfixing, side areas unfinished - Overall: 90%)
    CHAPTER 3: |||||||||- (Bugfixing, side areas unfinished - Overall: 90%)
    CHAPTER 4: ||||||||-- (Bugfixing, side areas unfinished - Overall: 80%)
    CHAPTER 5: |||||||||- (Bugfixing - Overall: 95%)
    CHAPTER 6: ||||||||-- (Bugfixing, side areas unfinished - Overall: 85%)
    CHAPTER 7: |||||||||- (Bugfixing - Overall: 95%)
    POSTGAME: ||-------- (Unfinished - Overall: 20%)

    OVERALL PROGRESS (ROUGH ESTIMATE): ||||||||-- - 85%
CURRENT FOCUS: General bugfixing, cleanup, side areas

Since I'm starting to recover a bit from all of my depression-related woes, I figure now's a good time to open a new thread for this, especially since I'm probably going to start working on it again soon.

EDIT 22/03/14 (D/M/Y): Current focus is between working on Chapter 5's story segments and Chapter 6's side-area segments.
EDIT 25/03/14: Current focus is Chapter 5's story segments. Chapter 6's side-area hub is going to wait until I'm working on the side-areas themselves, most likely.
EDIT 04/04/14: Current focus is now on the Forever Forest, in Chapter 5.
EDIT 23/04/14: Current focus is on Chapter 6 (Wonderfalls, The Void).
EDIT 24/04/14: Fixed Chapter 7 progress bar (It's not going to have any side-areas, goodness knows why I put that there)
EDIT 02/05/14: Updated progress bar (Still working on Wonderfalls - Chapter 6 only has two big areas in it, so it's probably not going to take too long).
EDIT 15/05/14: Updated progress bar (Currently working on Wasteland/Wonderfalls areas).
EDIT 09/06/14: Updated progress bar (Chapter 7 is very, very small, actually being the shortest chapter in the game.) Current focus is on Chapter 5/6 Adventures.
EDIT 19/06/14: Added Trailer to first post.
EDIT 28/06/14: Updated progress bar. Current focus is all over the place.
EDIT 02/07/14: Updated progress bars. For the most part, the overworld is finished, not counting adventure-completion events and other changes/generally polishing things that have to wait for now. Current focus is on Adventures.
EDIT 16/07/14: Updated progress bar - Need to finish up two adventures for the Forever Forest, then work on the Wasteland adventures. Current focus is that.
EDIT 03/07/15: Almost a year later. Updated progress bar - The core chapters are more or less finished by now, side areas and such are the next big focus. Right now, I'm focusing on the final chapter of the game - About half a dozen adventures left there, I'd say.
EDIT 28/12/15: Updated progress bar. Visit latest post for more details.
Last edited by Qloof234 on Tue Dec 29, 2015 2:38 am, edited 14 times in total.
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Post by Qloof234 » Thu Mar 06, 2014 12:39 am

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So porting levels over to the new Editor is really easy, unsurprisingly.

More of a "Yes I'm actually working on this again" post instead of actual progress, but hey. :P
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Post by Wonderland King » Thu Mar 06, 2014 1:07 am

Looks good... I'm glad it's continuing. :D
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Post by Qloof234 » Sun Mar 09, 2014 7:06 am

No significant updates just yet, most of the work has been checking that everything works correctly in the new Editor and a few bugfixes (I could be wrong but I think there aren't any real "serious" game-breakers that can happen by mistake at this point, which is good).

Current goal is to rip myself away from minor touch-ups and actually get back to serious work, which is easier said than done. :roll: :P

On that note, question time.

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This is what the Foggy Mountain caves look like, as shown in the old thread. Looking for opinions - What should I use for the music here? The regular cave theme, from WA1, or MoFI's cave ambience? I'm inclined to pick the latter, just curious as to what others think. :)
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Post by Jutomi » Sun Mar 09, 2014 7:14 am

They'd both fit there, and it's late, but here's my opinion any how.

I'd suggest the cavern noises. :D
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Post by Fluffshery » Sun Mar 09, 2014 7:26 am

I agree with Jutomi, it doesn't really matter; either would work. I would probably go with the MoFI one because I like that one better (unless I have them mixed up, which is entirely possible).
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Post by Qloof234 » Sun Mar 16, 2014 1:02 am

I think I'm going to go with MoFI's cave sounds, I think they sound a bit more fitting.

On another note:

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The Creepy Keep is my current focus, kind of. There are still some NPC events I need to set up regarding Chapter 4 (Fire Island), but for the most part, it's finished.
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Post by Koopson44 » Sun Mar 16, 2014 3:29 am

This looks awesome! Can't wait to see the final product!
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Post by Qloof234 » Sat Mar 22, 2014 10:58 pm

Updated the first post with a bit more detail regarding progress. The Creepy Keep is slowly taking form:

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On that note, a bit more status!

Adventures: 78 (87 including side-adventures I've put together)
Hub: 61 .dia files, 53 .wlv files

I didn't exactly intend on this kind of scale when I started, but... Hey, cool. :lol:
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Post by Jutomi » Sat Mar 22, 2014 11:09 pm

That looks impressive! :mrgreen:

I wish you lots of fortune with your later creations!

I'm excited for it. :D
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Post by Fluffshery » Sat Mar 22, 2014 11:35 pm

That looks really cool, Qloof!
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Post by Koopson44 » Sat Mar 22, 2014 11:48 pm

I am exited for this. Gives me something to think about. Also able to show me HOW to make a hub.
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Post by Wonderland King » Sat Mar 22, 2014 11:52 pm

Awesome! :D Out of curiosity, are you going to covert it into a regular hub when you're done? Because I know you didn't start HR with the official editor.
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Post by Qloof234 » Sat Mar 22, 2014 11:58 pm

Thanks for the positive comments! :D
Wonderland King wrote:Out of curiosity, are you going to covert it into a regular hub when you're done? Because I know you didn't start HR with the official editor.
By "regular", do you mean "Editor-compatible" as opposed to "WA3-mod"? If so, yeah. The only real difference between the two is that I need to set up the starting room so that it works correctly in PoTZ instead of dropping the player in the middle of the level (Since I started off testing it with MoFI I have it set up around MoFI's starting co-ordinates).

When it comes to the two versions, there are probably going to be some minor differences. An example is - if maps get added in some form to the Editor - that I'd like to include a MoFI-style world map so the player can check where areas are and such in-game. Since PoTZ doesn't support the map, the WA3 version won't have the map in it.
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Post by Wonderland King » Sun Mar 23, 2014 2:11 am

Okay, that makes sense. :)
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Post by Qloof234 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 5:20 am

dum de dum

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Adventures aside (of which I need three more for the Keep), the Creepy Keep is just about finished (maybe one more room, I'm not sure yet).

Next up is the Forever Forest. After that, the "story areas" I have planned:

- Lone Top (I know this was more for eye candy on WSW's map, but I'd like to have an adventure or two on it)
- The Wasteland
- Wonderfalls
- The Void
- Finale Area

After that, my priority is going to be bug-testing (mostly related to the post-game world, I expect), because I'm just about certain there are some serious NPC-event bugs still floating around (I know for a fact there are a few minor ones) - There's one in the Plains that I have no idea how to fix, so that's going to be fun. :roll:

Next would be side-areas and such - I've got a few areas started on, but they don't have any real substance to them yet.

Basically this is intensive work and I have a whole new level of respect for how much effort went into the WA trilogy.
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Post by Fluffshery » Wed Mar 26, 2014 5:51 am

That looks neat, although wouldn't the PotZ gates for the creepy keep be more fitting than the blue ones? It's your hub, so your graphics decisions, but just a thought.
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Post by dig 222 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 7:58 am

@Fluffshery
What about the void gates from Uo?
Those would look pretty good too.
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Post by Muzozavr » Wed Mar 26, 2014 8:42 am

I propose Lone Top to initially appear to be an empty "eye-candy" area, but then have the post-game "secret" content there. That way, you can remain true to WSW yet still make Lone Top useful.

(Also, please make the secret something that can be reasonably figured out by a single player, not like the POTZ one)
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Post by Koopson44 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 12:58 pm

OHHHH! Its halfway there! OHOH! Living on a prayer!
Its halfway done! Yay!
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Post by Qloof234 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 3:28 pm

Fluffshery wrote:That looks neat, although wouldn't the PotZ gates for the creepy keep be more fitting than the blue ones? It's your hub, so your graphics decisions, but just a thought.
dig 222 wrote:@Fluffshery
What about the void gates from Uo?
Those would look pretty good too.
They probably would fit a bit better, but I can only use one "gates" file for the whole hub (and that includes adventures).

Later on when I'm doing last-minute touch-ups, I might go back and work around that though.
Muzozavr wrote:I propose Lone Top to initially appear to be an empty "eye-candy" area, but then have the post-game "secret" content there. That way, you can remain true to WSW yet still make Lone Top useful.
I've already got the post-game secret linked to somewhere else that I think is fairly reasonable based on WSW's story, but this does give me an idea for Lone Top... :P
Muzozavr wrote:(Also, please make the secret something that can be reasonably figured out by a single player, not like the POTZ one)
Don't worry, even if I could do what PoTZ does for its endgame secret, I've got something else in mind here. It won't rely on teamwork to figure it out. :wink:
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Post by MyNameIsKooky » Wed Mar 26, 2014 4:59 pm

Whoa, these pictures look like something straight out of an official WA game. Amazing work here, can't wait to play! :D
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Post by Emerald141 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 5:35 pm

Yeah, I have to second that! I'm really looking forward to this project. :D
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Post by Koopson44 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 6:05 pm

Emerald141 wrote:Yeah, I have to second that! I'm really looking forward to this project. :D
Third. Also Approximately how many levels will it have?
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Post by Pawelec » Wed Mar 26, 2014 7:17 pm

MyNameIsKooky wrote:Whoa, these pictures look like something straight out of an official WA game.
Well, not for me. I bet Patrick would never go for such dark (I dare say they are... sad) graphics. They are definitely something new in WA and while in overall they seem to look well for me, there are some things I'd personally change or even remove. But it's not my hub and - as they say - there's no accounting for taste. If there are as many new ideas for adventures as for graphics, then I must play HR when the hub comes out!

There's one thing I'd like to note, as probably no one has thought about it: colours used in WA don't form a real rainbow together, but they can hardly be mistaken. My colourblind sister said that she has almost no problem with original WA colours, but she can't spot the difference between HR blue-indigo-purple trio and has some problems with orange-green pair. I think original WA colours are not just randomly chosen vivid ones, but they were picked up carefully to avoid them being confused with each other.
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Post by Jutomi » Wed Mar 26, 2014 7:23 pm

Well, at least, when the light level's stable.

I myself can't even tell the difference between any colours at some brightnesses. :|

Sometimes even my glow gem is not enough.
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Post by Qloof234 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:34 pm

MyNameIsKooky wrote:Whoa, these pictures look like something straight out of an official WA game. Amazing work here, can't wait to play! :D
Emerald141 wrote:Yeah, I have to second that! I'm really looking forward to this project. :D
Oh hush you guys, now you're just flattering me. :oops: :lol:
Koopson44 wrote:
Emerald141 wrote:Yeah, I have to second that! I'm really looking forward to this project. :D
Third. Also Approximately how many levels will it have?
Kinda hard to say at this point, all things considered. My guess for the main story is, hmm... Around 120, maybe? Not sure about side-areas/post-game yet.

Either way, the adventure count is going be comparable to one of the proper WA games for sure.
Pawelec wrote:Well, not for me. I bet Patrick would never go for such dark (I dare say they are... sad) graphics.
Do you mean in general, or the Creepy Keep? In general I'm trying to stick to the visual style that the WA games have, I've just added a bit more detail to the official textures.

As for the Keep, I'm aiming for something a bit darker and spookier with it. I don't think it's really that much worse than the Creepy Keep in PoTZ was, it's just a different approach.
Pawelec wrote:They are definitely something new in WA and while in overall they seem to look well for me, there are some things I'd personally change or even remove. But it's not my hub and - as they say - there's no accounting for taste. If there are as many new ideas for adventures as for graphics, then I must play HR when the hub comes out!
Heh, I'm not sure if I can promise that for adventures, but I'm hoping the final product will be fun at least. :)
Pawelec wrote:There's one thing I'd like to note, as probably no one has thought about it: colours used in WA don't form a real rainbow together, but they can hardly be mistaken. My colourblind sister said that she has almost no problem with original WA colours, but she can't spot the difference between HR blue-indigo-purple trio and has some problems with orange-green pair. I think original WA colours are not just randomly chosen vivid ones, but they were picked up carefully to avoid them being confused with each other.
This is an interesting point, and admittedly one I hadn't thought about. The reason I ended up changing the colours around was to try and actually get a "true" rainbow for the colour spectrum.

At this point, I don't think I'm going to go back and change everything back to its original colours (it's pretty deeply ingrained in there by now), but I definitely can provide a work-around that restores the colours to their WA originals.

(On that note, when you mention orange-green, do you mean in general, or with the pictures I've released of HR? The only colours I've modified are blue, indigo, and purple)
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Post by Koopson44 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:42 pm

Qloof234 wrote:
Koopson44 wrote:
Emerald141 wrote:Yeah, I have to second that! I'm really looking forward to this project. :D
Third. Also Approximately how many levels will it have?
Kinda hard to say at this point, all things considered. My guess for the main story is, hmm... Around 120, maybe? Not sure about side-areas/post-game yet.
Sounds cool! Can't wait to be frustrated! Nah im just kidding, but still i am terrible at puzzles.
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Post by Pawelec » Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:27 pm

Qloof234 wrote:
Pawelec wrote:Well, not for me. I bet Patrick would never go for such dark (I dare say they are... sad) graphics.
Do you mean in general, or the Creepy Keep? In general I'm trying to stick to the visual style that the WA games have, I've just added a bit more detail to the official textures.

As for the Keep, I'm aiming for something a bit darker and spookier with it. I don't think it's really that much worse than the Creepy Keep in PoTZ was, it's just a different approach.
I meant in general, the tonal modifications you made to the textures make them look faded. I especially dislike the purple-ish remake of Wondertown texture - it makes the place look somewhow like a graveyard and a bit post-apocaliptic... I'm certain no Stinker would like to live there . But, enough criticism, you've put much work into those textures. And the Creepy Keep texture is IMHO really good (it is much more Creepy, while PotZ one is much more Keep).
Qloof234 wrote:
Pawelec wrote:There's one thing I'd like to note, as probably no one has thought about it: colours used in WA don't form a real rainbow together, but they can hardly be mistaken. My colourblind sister said that she has almost no problem with original WA colours, but she can't spot the difference between HR blue-indigo-purple trio and has some problems with orange-green pair. I think original WA colours are not just randomly chosen vivid ones, but they were picked up carefully to avoid them being confused with each other.
This is an interesting point, and admittedly one I hadn't thought about. The reason I ended up changing the colours around was to try and actually get a "true" rainbow for the colour spectrum.

At this point, I don't think I'm going to go back and change everything back to its original colours (it's pretty deeply ingrained in there by now), but I definitely can provide a work-around that restores the colours to their WA originals.

(On that note, when you mention orange-green, do you mean in general, or with the pictures I've released of HR? The only colours I've modified are blue, indigo, and purple)
No one expects you to revert the changes - if my sister decides to play HR, I'll make needed graphic modifications myself. And about the green-orange: my sister said she has some troubles when there's HR blue in the level: she can easily say which one is blue, but she cannot distinguish green from orange. She had no troubles with the WA cyan version of blue. Interesting? Then read below about our little experiment.

From our family experience with my sister we know that colour blindness is VERY complex. So I made a colourtable (table with differently coloured cells placed in a random pattern) with green and orange cells, placed it over a black background, pointed the corner cell and asked if she could point and count all the cells in the same colour. She had no trouble, and when I changed the background to the WA cyan she also did it well. Then I switched the background to HR blue. She said the cells were pulsating (!) and wasn't able to count them. This means it's not only the main object's colour, but also the colouristic surroundings what affects her abililty to see difference in colour.
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Post by Master Wonder Mage » Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:32 pm

Pawelec wrote:
Qloof234 wrote:
Pawelec wrote:Well, not for me. I bet Patrick would never go for such dark (I dare say they are... sad) graphics.
Do you mean in general, or the Creepy Keep? In general I'm trying to stick to the visual style that the WA games have, I've just added a bit more detail to the official textures.

As for the Keep, I'm aiming for something a bit darker and spookier with it. I don't think it's really that much worse than the Creepy Keep in PoTZ was, it's just a different approach.
I meant in general, the tonal modifications you made to the textures make them look faded. I especially dislike the purple-ish remake of Wondertown texture - it makes the place look somewhow like a graveyard and a bit post-apocaliptic... I'm certain no Stinker would like to live there . But, enough criticism, you've put much work into those textures. And the Creepy Keep texture is IMHO really good (it is much more Creepy, while PotZ one is much more Keep).
I personally like Qloof's textures overall better, though I love things fairly dark in terms of mood, so yeah.
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