ignore this topic, do not reply

[Marinus]

My point is that you're talking about dictionaries and definitions as if they are facts, while they are only opinions or agreements, based on opinions.

[billy bob]

My point is that you're talking about dictionaries and definitions as if they are facts, while they are only opinions or agreements, based on opinions.

It's not an opinion, people made words a long time ago then they became fact.

[Marinus]

So, if someone has an opinion, and he waits a few years, or a few thousand years, suddenly his opinion become a fact?

[billy bob]

So, if someone has an opinion, and he waits a few years, or a few thousand years, suddenly his opinion become a fact?

No. It's what people made. And now that is what we speak, because somehow it became fact.

[Marinus]

It may be a fact that someone wrote a dictionary. But that doesn't mean that what's in the dictionary is a fact.

If I write a book, then you would say that it's fact that I wrote the book. But that doesn't mean that the story I wrote is true, or a fact.

[billy bob]

If I write a book, then you would say that it's fact that I wrote the book. But that doesn't mean that the story I wrote is true, or a fact.

Well, if what you're saying is true, then anything anyone says could mean anything different from the definition in the dictionary. The definition in a dictionary has to be fact otherwise no one could communicate with words because any word could mean any definition.

[Qloof234]

So, if someone has an opinion, and he waits a few years, or a few thousand years, suddenly his opinion become a fact?

No. It's what people made. And now that is what we speak, because somehow it became fact.

Here's the thing though - it's not fact. It's the general opinion of it. Almost everyone in the world agrees on it, hence it's the accepted definition.

It's not a fact of the universe like you're claiming it to be. If you're trying to prove that, you have to back it up. You can't just say "It somehow happened but I don't know how but it's still what happened" without any evidence and expect people to agree with you.

[billy bob]

So, if someone has an opinion, and he waits a few years, or a few thousand years, suddenly his opinion become a fact?

No. It's what people made. And now that is what we speak, because somehow it became fact.

Here's the thing though - it's not fact. It's the general opinion of it. Almost everyone in the world agrees on it, hence it's the accepted definition.

It's not a fact of the universe like you're claiming it to be. If you're trying to prove that, you have to back it up. You can't just say "It somehow happened but I don't know how but it's still what happened" without any evidence and expect people to agree with you.

Well, if it's not fact, then I can think that the words you used meant other things I just made up in my head, and now all the words you just said mean someone completely crazy. And now I can also think up some definitions in my head, and now the rules say I can post the word pencil on every serious topic existing.

So, basically, the definitions in the dictionaries have to be fact, otherwise anyone can think a word means something completely different from the definition of the word in dictionaries.

[Qloof234]

Except not everyone accepts those as a definition, so it's not "fact".

Plus, I already told you - in this topic, you're following the definition of rules as if it's a fact of the universe, and in eee's comic topic you're making up your own definition of R.I.P. that has no relevance to the widely accepted opinion.

You can't expect everyone to agree with you seamlessly like you're asking, especially considering how differently you think to the majority of the users here.

[billy bob]

Except not everyone accepts those as a definition, so it's not "fact".

But the definitions in dictionaries are fact. So those people are wrong about that word. If the definition in dictionaries aren't fact then there will be consequences that I have already explained.

Plus, I already told you - in this topic, you're following the definition of rules as if it's a fact of the universe, and in eee's comic topic you're making up your own definition of R.I.P. that has no relevance to the widely accepted opinion.

The definition of rules is fact. In Eee226's comic topic I wasn't making up my own definition of rest in peace, because in the dictionaries the word "rest", and "in", and "peace" together haven't got anything to do with death. Unless it is a phrase, then it is my mistake. However, there is a chance it would not have been the phrase and would have been just the three words if rest in peace is a phrase.

[Qloof234]

Except not everyone accepts those as a definition, so it's not "fact".

But the definitions in dictionaries are fact. So those people are wrong about that word. If the definition in dictionaries aren't fact then there will be consequences that I have already explained.

Except as has already been pointed out several times, that's not true. There's no such thing as concrete, unmovable knowledge in the world, and there's no such thing as a smart human being, because over time their ideas and understandings will be changed or even eradicated. There's no such thing as knowledge that's set in stone, because inevitably we're going to find something that overturns that belief system.

For instance, believing that the galaxy revolved around the Earth to finding out it revolved around the sun. The meaning of words are what humankind has come up with, and what it uses those words for. When it's widely accepted as being correct, it becomes "fact". Note the quotation marks.

Plus, I already told you - in this topic, you're following the definition of rules as if it's a fact of the universe, and in eee's comic topic you're making up your own definition of R.I.P. that has no relevance to the widely accepted opinion.

The definition of rules is fact. In Eee226's comic topic I wasn't making up my own definition of rest in peace, because in the dictionaries the word "rest", and "in", and "peace" together haven't got anything to do with death. Unless it is a phrase, then it is my mistake. However, there is a chance it would not have been the phrase and would have been just the three words if rest in peace is a phrase.

Once again - Only if it's widely regarded as true does it become a fact. In fact (no pun intended), here, I looked up the definition for rule:

rule
   /rul/ Show Spelled [rool] Show IPA ,noun, verb, ruled, rul·ing.
–noun
1.
a principle or regulation governing conduct, action, procedure, arrangement, etc.: the rules of chess.
2.
the code of regulations observed by a religious order or congregation: the Franciscan rule.
3.
the customary or normal circumstance, occurrence, manner, practice, quality, etc.: the rule rather than the exception.

These are some of the accepted definitions, but you know what? I looked in several different dictionaries and I only found your definition - unfaltering guidelines that have to be obeyed and policed no matter what, if I understand you correctly - in one. In other words, it's not widely accepted.

Also, you did make up a definition for R.I.P. - I went and checked for that as well:

rest in peace -- Definition of rest in peace

idiom to rest in peace

1. A blessing or expression of hope that a deceased person is at peace.

May the souls of the recently departed rest in peace.

1. (euphemism) To have passed away, or died.

I found this in all the dictionaries I checked. It's widely accepted as the definition. You went along and made a new definition out of your mind for it, intentionally or not.

[Marinus]

Yesterday I was talking about the most important thing, but I realize that was actually my second most important question. (You're very good at avoiding the main points and entering a side street, to distract other people's attention, but I'm not sure if I find that admirable) The most important question you still didn't answer if I'm right:

But it's about the definition you find in a dictionary, not in someone's mind.

5 Is the quote above to be found in a dictionary, or does it come out of someone's mind perhaps?

And the same question about everything you said in your big post yesterday about definitions en dictionaries. Also the sentences

It is not about ...... , but it is about ...... .

Is that to be found in a dictionary? Let me give the answer myself. No, no, and no! It is all coming from your mind. It is your opinion. In your opinion, it's a fact that this ..... , and it's a fact that that .... . But if something is a fact in your opinion doesn't mean that it is a fact. It's still your opinion. And if something in that opinion is not quite correct, that means that everything in that big post is not correct. And are you able to proof that your opinion is correct?

So, instead that I have to search for your opinion in a dictionary or so, I'd rather read it directly written by you. Also, if I read something in a dictionary and I don't quite understand, I can try and ask the dictionary, but I'm afraid the dictionary will not answer me. And I hope you will.

Edit:

Thanks. In that case, can we please have an agreement, that you don't call things an "obvious fact", while I think it's not an "obvious fact"?

OK.

[Marinus]

Therefore all I want to know is your opinion. What the dictionary, the rules, or Patrick say about this, I don't care at all, in this discussion with Q, BB and me.

And there is on this entire world only one person who can say for 100% sure what that means. And that person is me. If you wrote exactly the same words, it could mean something different.

Those 2 sentences are connected to each other. The second sentence is to make the first one more clear.

Also those three separate parts are connected to each other. With rules, dictionaries, and Patrick, I mean: Other people's opinion. And I'm pretty sure that's not what you mean with only "rules".

Also, " in this discussion with Q, BB and me." means something else then: "in general", so, if you forgot that part, or even worse, abandoned it on purpose, you changed something I wrote.

Also, the word "this":

What the dictionary, the rules, or Patrick say about this,

It seems you had no idea what I meant with that, since

My opinion about what about the rules?

So when you change my words in the quote, you had no idea what you changed.

What the dictionary, the rules, or Patrick say about this, I don't care at all...

What the rules say about this, I don't care at all...

I didn't forget to quote the rest. And if you look at all the words hat are not in bold you will see that it says almost the same thing. By putting the words in bold, that was just me saying what I was replying to. And frankly, this part of your post (and the next part) made me very upset.

So, you didn't forget, you did it on purpose! And the word "almost" makes a lot difference. But I hope I made clear now, that it was not even almost the same, it was quite different. You violated my words!

Please, don't do that ever again!

To be continued. At least, if you're still too proud to admit your mistakes.

I'm not wrong.

In the meantime, do you have an idea, what made you so upset?

[billy bob]

Also, the word "this":

What the dictionary, the rules, or Patrick say about this,

It seems you had no idea what I meant with that, since

My opinion about what about the rules?

So when you change my words in the quote, you had no idea what you changed.

What the dictionary, the rules, or Patrick say about this, I don't care at all...

What the rules say about this, I don't care at all...

I didn't forget to quote the rest. And if you look at all the words hat are not in bold you will see that it says almost the same thing. By putting the words in bold, that was just me saying what I was replying to. And frankly, this part of your post (and the next part) made me very upset.

So, you didn't forget, you did it on purpose! And the word "almost" makes a lot difference. But I hope I made clear now, that it was not even almost the same, it was quite different. You violated my words!

Please, don't do that ever again!

It was joke. Marinus, don't you really have sense of humor?

And if you are going to say it was unclear, then I can tell you it was just as unclear as your joke.

In the meantime, do you have an idea, what made you so upset?

You.

[Marinus]

XPR, I see you changed the title again. And perhaps you're right.

[DEEMAN223344]

reply

Topic, You've come too far. You will now DIE!

[Marinus]

Let's this topic "Rest in peace"

Continuing here:
http://www.pcpuzzle.com/forum/viewtopic ... 387#261387